Mmorpg Graveyard
by Prairie Games · in General Discussion · 06/21/2004 (8:40 pm) · 137 replies
Bring out yer dead...
Warhammer Online, Dead
Mythica, Dead
Ultima X Odyssey, Dead
Dragon Empires, Dead
Horizons, soon to be Dead
-Josh
Warhammer Online, Dead
Mythica, Dead
Ultima X Odyssey, Dead
Dragon Empires, Dead
Horizons, soon to be Dead
-Josh
#122
==================================================================================================
Kelly: Welcome to Rackspace. My name is Kelly and I am a Live sales assistant. How may I help you today?
you: Hi, I was just having a look at your site, getting some info...
you: I mentioned rackspace.com in a message forum as a possible hosting service for game developers, on the subject of massive multiplayer games...
Kelly: Thanks for your plug and interest.
Kelly: If I can help you with anything, please do not hesitate to ask.
you: For something like this, would require multiple servers, and personel to monitor the servers to insure smooth operation, do you have any service like that?
Kelly: Yes, we offer groups of servers, connected by Private net, our managed hosting solutions are monitored by systems and people with true 24x7 support at all levels.
Kelly: As far as connecting servers for one game, I am assuming that would be done at the game/application level.
you: Excellent, would you mind if I copied and pasted this conversation into the forums at garagegames.com so other developers will know about the servies you offer?
you: Yes, the server code would be running on your equipment, no need for any rendering, just clients conecting and being directed to the appropriate server..
Kelly: Yes, you can do that.
Kelly: ...we provide 24/7/365 FANATICAL Support, Zero "0" Network Downtime (100% Uptime), Your Own Dedicated Support Team and Account Manager, and a 1- Hour Hardware Replacement, Guaranteed!
Kelly: There is some more for you to add.
you: Thank you, there was a posting to the effect that most hosting services are limited to "push button to reset server", I get the impression your service offers so much more than that :)
Kelly: Yes, we actually fully support the OS, so you can get things fixed, instead of reinstalling an OS or rebooting.
Kelly: we even offer best effort support for 3rd party applications, not as much an issue with gaming, but invaluable for application servers, ecommerce, etc.
you: The way I'd go about running such a server would include "remote administration", I would provide instructions for anything that couldn't be done remotely.
Kelly: Yes, we typically have done about anything you can imagine at least once, and our staff is phenomenal, nearly 500 in US and UK , and nearly 2/3 of those are support and operations.
you: Excellent :)
==================================================================================================
I'm still going to see if there's other services like this, so far this is the best one I've found.
Or do I want to,
1) Rent a building with adequate space for a couple dozen server machines.
2) Have 2 or more T1 lines to the building (redundant lines are necessary, as I found out in a business communications course).
3) Install the necessary equipment to connect the lans to the internet.
4) Hire a personell director to hire qualified personel to perform maintanence on software and equipment, handle the helpdesk, handle the billing, maintain the website, etc.
5) You still need more than one person to be on the development team, kind of hard to do everything yourself. (game code, textures, skins, other graphics, models, map objects...)
6) Have an attorney on retainer to make sure all the legal aspects are covered.
7) Acquire trademarks for the company name and product name and copyright the source codes and other written items and graphics (what is it, about $2,000 per trademark? I could be wrong...)
8) Still wind up with a game that sucks and nobody wants to play.. lol, j/k
07/11/2004 (6:53 pm)
I went to rackspace.com to look over the service plans they have to offer and what level of service they provide. A chat window popped up with a representative of theirs. Here is how the conversation went:==================================================================================================
Kelly: Welcome to Rackspace. My name is Kelly and I am a Live sales assistant. How may I help you today?
you: Hi, I was just having a look at your site, getting some info...
you: I mentioned rackspace.com in a message forum as a possible hosting service for game developers, on the subject of massive multiplayer games...
Kelly: Thanks for your plug and interest.
Kelly: If I can help you with anything, please do not hesitate to ask.
you: For something like this, would require multiple servers, and personel to monitor the servers to insure smooth operation, do you have any service like that?
Kelly: Yes, we offer groups of servers, connected by Private net, our managed hosting solutions are monitored by systems and people with true 24x7 support at all levels.
Kelly: As far as connecting servers for one game, I am assuming that would be done at the game/application level.
you: Excellent, would you mind if I copied and pasted this conversation into the forums at garagegames.com so other developers will know about the servies you offer?
you: Yes, the server code would be running on your equipment, no need for any rendering, just clients conecting and being directed to the appropriate server..
Kelly: Yes, you can do that.
Kelly: ...we provide 24/7/365 FANATICAL Support, Zero "0" Network Downtime (100% Uptime), Your Own Dedicated Support Team and Account Manager, and a 1- Hour Hardware Replacement, Guaranteed!
Kelly: There is some more for you to add.
you: Thank you, there was a posting to the effect that most hosting services are limited to "push button to reset server", I get the impression your service offers so much more than that :)
Kelly: Yes, we actually fully support the OS, so you can get things fixed, instead of reinstalling an OS or rebooting.
Kelly: we even offer best effort support for 3rd party applications, not as much an issue with gaming, but invaluable for application servers, ecommerce, etc.
you: The way I'd go about running such a server would include "remote administration", I would provide instructions for anything that couldn't be done remotely.
Kelly: Yes, we typically have done about anything you can imagine at least once, and our staff is phenomenal, nearly 500 in US and UK , and nearly 2/3 of those are support and operations.
you: Excellent :)
==================================================================================================
I'm still going to see if there's other services like this, so far this is the best one I've found.
Or do I want to,
1) Rent a building with adequate space for a couple dozen server machines.
2) Have 2 or more T1 lines to the building (redundant lines are necessary, as I found out in a business communications course).
3) Install the necessary equipment to connect the lans to the internet.
4) Hire a personell director to hire qualified personel to perform maintanence on software and equipment, handle the helpdesk, handle the billing, maintain the website, etc.
5) You still need more than one person to be on the development team, kind of hard to do everything yourself. (game code, textures, skins, other graphics, models, map objects...)
6) Have an attorney on retainer to make sure all the legal aspects are covered.
7) Acquire trademarks for the company name and product name and copyright the source codes and other written items and graphics (what is it, about $2,000 per trademark? I could be wrong...)
8) Still wind up with a game that sucks and nobody wants to play.. lol, j/k
#123
Anyway, I'm not at all into MMORPGs, or even much into RPGs. But I do find the idea of a persistant multiplayer online world very interesting.
It may be true enough that there is a huge market for these games, I just don't see it at this point. The first main stumbleing block for me is the tired old cliched D&D type "fantasy" worlds most of these games take place in. At least in the Final Fantasy games there is some tolken acknowledgement that "fantasy" need not be limited to dwarves, elves, and magic users.
Maybe City of Heros may turn things around, it certainly does't fit the mold of the typical setting for MMORPGs (and there will likely be the anal retentive types that insist it can't be a RPG because it lacks the necissary cliched crap that has fully trapped the genre in the perverbial box)...And maybe upcomeing developments like Sims Online and GTA: Online could further help the genre to reach out in new directions for the all elusive players.
As a parting thought, how about a MMORPG that takes place in a cartoon world? sorta like Toon Town from the Who Framed Roger Rabbit flick...Players take control of 'toons. No "treadmill" or "end game", as there is no need for level advancement, and 'toons can't die so that is taken care of. Players could form something along the lines of a guild, and these guilds could vote for fellow members to recieve "power-up" items (run faster, the ability to overcome gravity momentarily when stepping off a ledge, see stars instead of birds when knocked over the head, etc..) The guilds could then recieve the "power-ups" through putting on community shows (like theatrical plays and such) this could be sorta like a "battle of the guilds" type thing with a number of guilds competeing to win and players in the audiance voteing on whom they thought was best...could also go another way, sorta like a Dance dance Revolution type game, in which there are a number of established "standards, gags, dance steps" whatever that the player must pull off...the more correctly they mimic the dance/gag, the better the reward (and that much better they must do next time it to see any future award).
There is lots of potential when you start thinking outside the box :)
07/11/2004 (8:33 pm)
I haven't posted here in a long while, and a recent conversation at work helped to refuel my intrest in indie games development...So I'm back, for now, and you all have been warned. :PAnyway, I'm not at all into MMORPGs, or even much into RPGs. But I do find the idea of a persistant multiplayer online world very interesting.
It may be true enough that there is a huge market for these games, I just don't see it at this point. The first main stumbleing block for me is the tired old cliched D&D type "fantasy" worlds most of these games take place in. At least in the Final Fantasy games there is some tolken acknowledgement that "fantasy" need not be limited to dwarves, elves, and magic users.
Maybe City of Heros may turn things around, it certainly does't fit the mold of the typical setting for MMORPGs (and there will likely be the anal retentive types that insist it can't be a RPG because it lacks the necissary cliched crap that has fully trapped the genre in the perverbial box)...And maybe upcomeing developments like Sims Online and GTA: Online could further help the genre to reach out in new directions for the all elusive players.
As a parting thought, how about a MMORPG that takes place in a cartoon world? sorta like Toon Town from the Who Framed Roger Rabbit flick...Players take control of 'toons. No "treadmill" or "end game", as there is no need for level advancement, and 'toons can't die so that is taken care of. Players could form something along the lines of a guild, and these guilds could vote for fellow members to recieve "power-up" items (run faster, the ability to overcome gravity momentarily when stepping off a ledge, see stars instead of birds when knocked over the head, etc..) The guilds could then recieve the "power-ups" through putting on community shows (like theatrical plays and such) this could be sorta like a "battle of the guilds" type thing with a number of guilds competeing to win and players in the audiance voteing on whom they thought was best...could also go another way, sorta like a Dance dance Revolution type game, in which there are a number of established "standards, gags, dance steps" whatever that the player must pull off...the more correctly they mimic the dance/gag, the better the reward (and that much better they must do next time it to see any future award).
There is lots of potential when you start thinking outside the box :)
#124
@MSW: Toontown by Disney is doing exactly that. I don't know what stage of development it's in, but it has most of the features you're talking about(fun factor instead of health, etc). Very nice idea. And yes, it thoroughly sucks to see PW after PW come out where the developer is like "well, this is different because you can play a!" I always like the "science-fantasy", Heavy-Metal genre, so there's an influence of that in mine(no dwarves or elves).
As for the market, I think it has more to do with people coming to terms with the medium than the market maturing, as CG and anime have always faired better in asia where it's considered just another art form, and treated more maturely than here in the west where it's held as a children's thing, no matter how mature it gets. That's changing though, and the next generation of westerners shouldn't have that hangup...
07/12/2004 (2:39 am)
@Don: Damn good point you have there. rackspace.com huh? That conversation you posted got my gears turning now, I'll have to drop them a line and start talking about prices. Most places only do the reset thing, but support like that is very nice to have, and I'm glad you brought that up =)@MSW: Toontown by Disney is doing exactly that. I don't know what stage of development it's in, but it has most of the features you're talking about(fun factor instead of health, etc). Very nice idea. And yes, it thoroughly sucks to see PW after PW come out where the developer is like "well, this is different because you can play a
As for the market, I think it has more to do with people coming to terms with the medium than the market maturing, as CG and anime have always faired better in asia where it's considered just another art form, and treated more maturely than here in the west where it's held as a children's thing, no matter how mature it gets. That's changing though, and the next generation of westerners shouldn't have that hangup...
#125
There is a very strong business reason for leasing servers as opposed to buying them and running your own network: tax deductions.
As my business mentor explained to me in great detail, there are two basic types of companies: those that provide product, and those that provide services. Pretty much any MMOG is in all actuality a "service providing" company--yes, you sell your initial game as a "product", but your primary revenue will be from the server network "service" that you provide. If you are a service company, it makes very little business sense to actually own assets.
If you buy the servers and infrastructure, they are considered business assets, and are -not- tax deductable. If you lease the servers and architecture, they are considered business expenses, and are fully tax deductable, making your bottom line a -lot- more attractive. When you factor in constructing and staffing a NOC, all the insurance you'll need to cover that NOC, and the rest of the hidden expenses associated with a large infrastructure, leasing that infrastructure is a really good idea...
07/12/2004 (1:07 pm)
Quote:
Rent a couple of T1's and hook up your own network, I say. It's not hard to set up the domain controllers and such, and you'll need the network when you put your company together anyway, so why not go the whole 9 and put the game network in place too(obviously, you want those two networks seperated from each other for security purposes).
There is a very strong business reason for leasing servers as opposed to buying them and running your own network: tax deductions.
As my business mentor explained to me in great detail, there are two basic types of companies: those that provide product, and those that provide services. Pretty much any MMOG is in all actuality a "service providing" company--yes, you sell your initial game as a "product", but your primary revenue will be from the server network "service" that you provide. If you are a service company, it makes very little business sense to actually own assets.
If you buy the servers and infrastructure, they are considered business assets, and are -not- tax deductable. If you lease the servers and architecture, they are considered business expenses, and are fully tax deductable, making your bottom line a -lot- more attractive. When you factor in constructing and staffing a NOC, all the insurance you'll need to cover that NOC, and the rest of the hidden expenses associated with a large infrastructure, leasing that infrastructure is a really good idea...
#126
Erm, So a service basied buisness like Rackspace shouldn't own network servers and infrastructure assets...Gee, just think of all those great tax deductions they are missing out on :P
Course, if your buisness does own the servers and infrastructure to support them. Well you can always generate revenue by leaseing out the network to other clients, in the unfortunate event that your game fails to meet expectations...You see, it makes very little buisness sense not to have such back up plans.
@Ted: Er, Disney is working on ToonTown? I Didn't know that (damn, scratch off yet another of "my great ideas no one has thought of before"). I'll have to look into it, sounds like fun...sorta...it is Disney after all. I was thinking along the lines of something quite a bit more racey then the typical Disney fare :P
I do think the market needs to mature a bit more though. especialy on the retail side of the PC game market. I am an "old school" twich heavy type gamer, rasied during the arcade days of Pac-Man and Robotron. Heavily influenced by the great games of the NES, Genesis, PC-16 and SNES. An action game to me is Super Metroid, a shooter is R-Type...But on the PC retail side of things a action and/or shooter currently means FPS, nothing really wrong with that. I just wish that the market would support more variety. For every Duke Nukem: Manhattan Project there seems to be at least five dozen "me too" FPS. a while ago I picked up Tron 2.0, incorrectly thinking it would be a fun game in the spirit of the old arcade classics that were both influced and were inspired by the film. Big dissapointment, that game, it nailed the look, but completely missed out on exploiting it's massive "old school" gameplay potential...well, the lightcycles were okay :P
Course, things are much brighter on the shareware and indie side of the PC market :D
07/12/2004 (4:11 pm)
Quote:
If you are a service company, it makes very little business sense to actually own assets.
Erm, So a service basied buisness like Rackspace shouldn't own network servers and infrastructure assets...Gee, just think of all those great tax deductions they are missing out on :P
Course, if your buisness does own the servers and infrastructure to support them. Well you can always generate revenue by leaseing out the network to other clients, in the unfortunate event that your game fails to meet expectations...You see, it makes very little buisness sense not to have such back up plans.
@Ted: Er, Disney is working on ToonTown? I Didn't know that (damn, scratch off yet another of "my great ideas no one has thought of before"). I'll have to look into it, sounds like fun...sorta...it is Disney after all. I was thinking along the lines of something quite a bit more racey then the typical Disney fare :P
I do think the market needs to mature a bit more though. especialy on the retail side of the PC game market. I am an "old school" twich heavy type gamer, rasied during the arcade days of Pac-Man and Robotron. Heavily influenced by the great games of the NES, Genesis, PC-16 and SNES. An action game to me is Super Metroid, a shooter is R-Type...But on the PC retail side of things a action and/or shooter currently means FPS, nothing really wrong with that. I just wish that the market would support more variety. For every Duke Nukem: Manhattan Project there seems to be at least five dozen "me too" FPS. a while ago I picked up Tron 2.0, incorrectly thinking it would be a fun game in the spirit of the old arcade classics that were both influced and were inspired by the film. Big dissapointment, that game, it nailed the look, but completely missed out on exploiting it's massive "old school" gameplay potential...well, the lightcycles were okay :P
Course, things are much brighter on the shareware and indie side of the PC market :D
#127
Last time I checked, it wasn't in the business plan for most game companies to provide infrastructure and servers to their customers for whatever usage they desire.
07/12/2004 (5:59 pm)
@MSW: You missed the point entirely. Rackspace's entire business model is designed around the fact that OTHERS shouldn't be owning server assets, and they provide those assets. It is their BUSINESS to build infrastructure and own assets, and they make money off of it. You could arguably claim this is a 'service' and therefore the general breakdown I outlined isn't accurate--feel free.Last time I checked, it wasn't in the business plan for most game companies to provide infrastructure and servers to their customers for whatever usage they desire.
#128
I posted to this thread in order to address the relevant gameplay and service issues that the MMOG market has been known for, offer my own decisions on what could be done to vanquish these concerns, and help others to think outside the box. I despise the current linup of games because of their inability to address many of these concerns which, like in Josh's case, negates attention to the MMO platform in so many ways.
Jarrad mentioned the massive world of Runescape, and though his post has been most likely overlooked by many, you should indeed take a look at what Andrew Gower and his team at Jagex have done with RS. Though on the surface the game still retains the similar gameplay aspects of it's corporate bretheren (in fact quite a bit similar to UO), they offer the game services at an astoundingly different level, which is free for non-members, yet at only about $5 per month per member. Makes you wonder how cost efficient they are to maintain their 30 or so servers huh? Not to forget the other free multiplayer games they offer from their main site, nor their tech/customer support.
Now, I want you both to understand that I know what you speak of in terms of the costs of running such a game. I also want you to understand that when I said it's still on the back burner, that this is a major reason why and that other titles will be released before the MMO game in order to support it when the time has come. The marketing and sales made from these prevoiusly released titles (as well as other projects) will be able to fuel the release of the game and prolong it untill it has achieved it's own balance of profit. This is why I posted the website.
Another thing I should explain is the handling of data, hack, and support issues. These are areas that have taken alot of time to develop solutions for and will always be there to bug us. The steps I wish to take will involve:
- Alot of automation on the server-side
- A custom code generated by myself to encrypt data as well as verify client-servers
- The derivitive data structuring, which I've mentioned before, which will be designed to eliminate certain hacks as well as decrease lag by significantly decreasing packet sizes
- As support goes, a mostly player-based support system for gameplay issues and tech support to be the main concern for a working crew of about 20 or so (this is a little etchy still).
Yes, I agree that I have yet to think of completely everything, but that will come later. ;)
Thank you very much for being concerned and I hope that if the question should ever arise as to this type of situation again, that you both take the same actions and continue to help others.
I'm always willing to debate about developer worries myself and the fact that it's also my concern as to what should be done gives me reason to continue to research new areas. It just sucks going at it alone.
- Christopher "Ronixus" Dapo
07/12/2004 (8:44 pm)
@ Ted And Paul -I posted to this thread in order to address the relevant gameplay and service issues that the MMOG market has been known for, offer my own decisions on what could be done to vanquish these concerns, and help others to think outside the box. I despise the current linup of games because of their inability to address many of these concerns which, like in Josh's case, negates attention to the MMO platform in so many ways.
Jarrad mentioned the massive world of Runescape, and though his post has been most likely overlooked by many, you should indeed take a look at what Andrew Gower and his team at Jagex have done with RS. Though on the surface the game still retains the similar gameplay aspects of it's corporate bretheren (in fact quite a bit similar to UO), they offer the game services at an astoundingly different level, which is free for non-members, yet at only about $5 per month per member. Makes you wonder how cost efficient they are to maintain their 30 or so servers huh? Not to forget the other free multiplayer games they offer from their main site, nor their tech/customer support.
Now, I want you both to understand that I know what you speak of in terms of the costs of running such a game. I also want you to understand that when I said it's still on the back burner, that this is a major reason why and that other titles will be released before the MMO game in order to support it when the time has come. The marketing and sales made from these prevoiusly released titles (as well as other projects) will be able to fuel the release of the game and prolong it untill it has achieved it's own balance of profit. This is why I posted the website.
Another thing I should explain is the handling of data, hack, and support issues. These are areas that have taken alot of time to develop solutions for and will always be there to bug us. The steps I wish to take will involve:
- Alot of automation on the server-side
- A custom code generated by myself to encrypt data as well as verify client-servers
- The derivitive data structuring, which I've mentioned before, which will be designed to eliminate certain hacks as well as decrease lag by significantly decreasing packet sizes
- As support goes, a mostly player-based support system for gameplay issues and tech support to be the main concern for a working crew of about 20 or so (this is a little etchy still).
Yes, I agree that I have yet to think of completely everything, but that will come later. ;)
Thank you very much for being concerned and I hope that if the question should ever arise as to this type of situation again, that you both take the same actions and continue to help others.
I'm always willing to debate about developer worries myself and the fact that it's also my concern as to what should be done gives me reason to continue to research new areas. It just sucks going at it alone.
- Christopher "Ronixus" Dapo
#129
Erm, That was exactly the point I tried to make.
plans change, always have, always will...Even if you make the best MMORPG of all time, if you don't get enough paying players, you will be broke in short order...we all can name some absolutely great games that for whatever reason end up being completely overlooked. That is a risk of the industry that your, mine, or anyone elses games are never going to be exempt from.
One of the ways to reduce that risk is to keep the game up and running, allowing player word of mouth to indocturate newbies far better then slick advertiseing (costs far less too). that can't really be done if you run out of cash to pay for the games overhead...And you can't really be persueing the deveolpment of "bread and butter" games to keep the company afloat, when you and your team must keep ontop of your MMORPGs further developments.
So if you had purchased the servers, and built the infrastructure...in such cases it could prove worth while to sublease part of the companies assets just to keep your head above water long enough to greet all those newbies migrateing to your domain.
Owning or leaseing networks is one of those tough buisness decisions. for capitol poor start-ups it can make a lot of sense to rent..but then over time, as the game possably starts to gain momentum, as issues start to pop up...You may very well find that you need more direct control over the servers then the leased network providers allow.
07/13/2004 (8:23 am)
Quote:
@MSW: You missed the point entirely. Rackspace's entire business model is designed around the fact that OTHERS shouldn't be owning server assets, and they provide those assets. It is their BUSINESS to build infrastructure and own assets, and they make money off of it. You could arguably claim this is a 'service' and therefore the general breakdown I outlined isn't accurate--feel free.
Erm, That was exactly the point I tried to make.
Quote:
Last time I checked, it wasn't in the business plan for most game companies to provide infrastructure and servers to their customers for whatever usage they desire.
plans change, always have, always will...Even if you make the best MMORPG of all time, if you don't get enough paying players, you will be broke in short order...we all can name some absolutely great games that for whatever reason end up being completely overlooked. That is a risk of the industry that your, mine, or anyone elses games are never going to be exempt from.
One of the ways to reduce that risk is to keep the game up and running, allowing player word of mouth to indocturate newbies far better then slick advertiseing (costs far less too). that can't really be done if you run out of cash to pay for the games overhead...And you can't really be persueing the deveolpment of "bread and butter" games to keep the company afloat, when you and your team must keep ontop of your MMORPGs further developments.
So if you had purchased the servers, and built the infrastructure...in such cases it could prove worth while to sublease part of the companies assets just to keep your head above water long enough to greet all those newbies migrateing to your domain.
Owning or leaseing networks is one of those tough buisness decisions. for capitol poor start-ups it can make a lot of sense to rent..but then over time, as the game possably starts to gain momentum, as issues start to pop up...You may very well find that you need more direct control over the servers then the leased network providers allow.
#130
Owning or leaseing networks is one of those tough buisness decisions. for capitol poor start-ups it can make a lot of sense to rent..but then over time, as the game possably starts to gain momentum, as issues start to pop up...You may very well find that you need more direct control over the servers then the leased network providers allow.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
That'd be the way to do it, IMO. Rent the servers and see how things go first. You don't want to spend a million for all the equipment and then your game turns out to be a flop, if you wind up having to sell off the equipment to regain some of the loss it will be for less than you paid for it.
Rent first, and save the profits toward owning your own server network if it looks like the popularity of the game will justify it.
Turbine's Asheron's Call was published and hosted on Microsoft's Gaming Zone servers. Now Turbine owns their own servers to run the game on, after 5 or 6 years of Microsoft hosting it. That's a general figure, might have been longer than that. But it's a good example of rent first, buy later; even by a company with deeper pockets than probably anyone here.
07/13/2004 (8:22 pm)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Owning or leaseing networks is one of those tough buisness decisions. for capitol poor start-ups it can make a lot of sense to rent..but then over time, as the game possably starts to gain momentum, as issues start to pop up...You may very well find that you need more direct control over the servers then the leased network providers allow.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
That'd be the way to do it, IMO. Rent the servers and see how things go first. You don't want to spend a million for all the equipment and then your game turns out to be a flop, if you wind up having to sell off the equipment to regain some of the loss it will be for less than you paid for it.
Rent first, and save the profits toward owning your own server network if it looks like the popularity of the game will justify it.
Turbine's Asheron's Call was published and hosted on Microsoft's Gaming Zone servers. Now Turbine owns their own servers to run the game on, after 5 or 6 years of Microsoft hosting it. That's a general figure, might have been longer than that. But it's a good example of rent first, buy later; even by a company with deeper pockets than probably anyone here.
#131
"technical issues"?
Someone recently said that MMORPG were the dot.com of the game industry... that's a mighty good analogy... EQ is like Google in terms of dot.com... I am guessing we'll see some funky EQ -> EQ2 press release soon...
WoW is going to be a success, and they are building on quite a property already...
D&D Online will be cancled is my prediction... and Middle Earth: Online will be something like Star Wars Galaxies... the game will suck, but the property will keep it going...
-Josh
09/03/2004 (5:06 pm)
Codemasters announces: Dragon Empires development ceased due to technical issues... "technical issues"?
Someone recently said that MMORPG were the dot.com of the game industry... that's a mighty good analogy... EQ is like Google in terms of dot.com... I am guessing we'll see some funky EQ -> EQ2 press release soon...
WoW is going to be a success, and they are building on quite a property already...
D&D Online will be cancled is my prediction... and Middle Earth: Online will be something like Star Wars Galaxies... the game will suck, but the property will keep it going...
-Josh
#132
Yeah, MMORPG's look like they're dying off. Have a look at http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/gameId/0 and see for yourselves..
09/03/2004 (8:51 pm)
Yeah, MMORPG's look like they're dying off. Have a look at http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/gameId/0 and see for yourselves..
#133
Here is a quote from Codemasters:
"However, after a full, in-depth analysis, research and review, it has been decided by the board that the project has too many risks to be considered viable at this time."
-Josh
09/03/2004 (9:05 pm)
MMORPG is here to stay... Here is a quote from Codemasters:
"However, after a full, in-depth analysis, research and review, it has been decided by the board that the project has too many risks to be considered viable at this time."
-Josh
#134
I just wish some of these failed MMORPGs would release their art assets for general use :)
09/03/2004 (10:03 pm)
Dragon Empires looked really good too - I've been on the beta waiting list for nearly a year.I just wish some of these failed MMORPGs would release their art assets for general use :)
#135
Oh man, if only...
-JoSh RiTtEr
PrAiRiE GaMeS
09/03/2004 (10:44 pm)
"I just wish some of these failed MMORPGs would release their art assets for general use :)"Oh man, if only...
-JoSh RiTtEr
PrAiRiE GaMeS
#136
Josh knows what he's talking about when he said "MMORPG is here to stay... "
:)
09/04/2004 (1:02 am)
That link I posted lists about 70 current MMORPG's and how popular they are. it also lists about 61 more that're either under development or in beta testing.Josh knows what he's talking about when he said "MMORPG is here to stay... "
:)
#137
09/08/2004 (4:10 am)
Im downloading Lore demo right now after all these 2 games called marble blast gold and Lore are going to be bought BTW Lore is better then think tank's and hope it will never be removed cause it's great also network play is included and it has the gameplay as gundam wing the movie.
Torque Owner Paul Malyschko
You had good solutions for the problems that you outlined, but the ones that weren't automated required human power. As an example, I'll use the karma system you described. My knowledge of it is incomplete, so work with me here. How many support reps would you need for 1000 people on at the same time? I suppose it would depend on how closely you monitored them.
These are just things for you to think about, anyway. When I go about the process of designing games, I don't usually bother thinking of it in financial terms, but with MMORPGs it's not something you can afford to ignore.
As for all the technical stuff, I'm sure you've read everyone else's posts about that. They'll tell you more than I ever can.